C3 Exclusive Interview | Brooke Burgess Talks Nintendo Wii / DS, Broken Saints & More (Transcript)

Be sure to also read through our first interview with Brooke.
Brooke Burgess: Hi James

James Temperton: Hi Brooke

BB: How ya doin?

JT: I'm good thanks, how are you?

BB: Thank you so much for taking the time. I think it's really, really cool that Cubed³, your gang, your team were able to take the time to do this.

JT: Well, thank you very much as well. I think it's Adam who's got an absolute obsession of your comic *Brooke's laughter*

BB: That's so sweet. I still remember he being one of the original forum rats on our online site, so yeah he's certainly cool

JT: Yeah, so Adam's set me up to do this, so I've been doing a lot of research about yourself…all good stuff!

BB: Thank you.

JT: And I've been reading through a lot of bits and bobs - the interview you did with Adam as well, and to start off as kind of a good question to start off - do you believe Broken Saints will be a big hit in Europe, as it has been in the USA, and are there any plans for it to launch in Asia, Japan and Korea especially? What's the future for the distribution of the series?

BB: I think that Fox is taking definitely a wait-see attitude, because they know it's going to be a slow burner. This is not a go on store shelves and all of a sudden sold out with people screaming on the streets and it's Broken Saints mania…no. *laughter* This is something where this will launch and hardcore fans and people who are really curious about it and hearing about it in the Press will pick it up. And then hopefully word-of-mouth, like it did with the original series, people will evangelise it and it will spread from there.

Now, it's surprisingly, the original site was always more popular in Europe than it was in North America.

JT: Oh right.

BB: So it's been well received here and the people who love it, love it. It's actually like very polarising, which I love about any artistic project when it can inspire people to either like love it and be passionate about it, or detest it…

JT: Yeah, but either way…

BB: And that's the response in America. Either people love it, get it, know where it's coming from and they know how experimental it is and how different it is…or it's like "This isn't fully animated! This isn't full of action! This is stupid!"

JT: Yeah, so…

BB: Yeah, well, we're happy not to have you as a viewer then…*laughs* That said, that's the North American response and I've found that we've always had this really fervent, aware and supportive stance from our European readers, watchers, listeners and I actually think it will do quite well in Europe. I don't necessarily think it will sell thousands upon thousands, but I think it will do quite well in the territory where we've traditionally had visitors browse from - UK, Italy, France, Germany, Spain - definitely the northern European countries for sure. It's just that I think there's the difference in the quality of education, in cultural issues and awareness, in being more wordly and not so protectionist and that kind of bodes well for the series.

JT: So you think that because Broken Saints as a series is quite challenging, it looks at lots of big issues and deals with quite important things, that the American public is perhaps a bit more narrow-minded in respect to the Europeans…

BB: I think that they're a bit more narrow-minded and they're not as open to new forms of presentation. Art is something that's not really stressed in American schools any more, or critical thinking, or poetic language. These are things that are almost foreign or alien. I find that that's why when we do get reviewed by someone that totally gets it, or when we do find North American fans that will resonate with it, they write soliloquies of their own in praise of the work and they are thankful something like this exists and that means a lot to us.

But, for the mainstream, not so much…Like they'll wait for something to explode; they're waiting for breasts to be revealed on screen; they're waiting for a really simple explanation of it all and all of a sudden they hear some poetic dialogue and go 'What?!'

JT: Because it's profound and obscure to them…

BB: It's hard to process and that's hard for them. I think that's less the case in Europe. I think that that's something that's infused culturally across the board.

JT: How would you like to see it promoted in America and Europe? How do you think would be the best way to sell Broken Saints; to get it out there and get people paying attention to it?

BB: I think the best way to get it out there is to voice this to FOX and we can drop a little bit of budget regarding it…But the best way to get it out there has always been with the personal touch. It has always been evangelising, like members of our team going to conventions, doing lectures at Universities, doing screenings and talking about the specific aspects of it. Because when we do that, the response is immediate - you can tell right away what people are resonating with and what they don't and the usually the response is incredibly positive and we get people saying "Okay, you've got me so excited and so inspired by what you guys have done and with no money and being just self-taught, I just have to see what you've made!"

I think that personal approach, that road-show, that evangelical approach, really works. It's what we, we couldn't do it physically in person, but it's kind of what we did with the website originally. We responded to almost every single fan mail with a really personal message. We tried to involve the fans in the process of spreading the word of the series. I think that putting that grass-roots movement around it was the key to its success. And then on top of that, of course, as far as a slightly more traditional campaign is concerned, I think it's about FOX and the related distribution vendors and the territories kind of taking a cryptic promotional approach; the kind of thing they did with Donnie Darko. It's to stick with the tagline of 'What would you give to know the truth?' - the conspiratorial aspects of the series, and maybe do poster campaigns, radio blips or online contests to make people THINK that something mysterious is happening and WANT to understand more about it.

JT: So they get involved in the idea of Broken Saints. I think what you say about the importance of the personal touch remaining; is that something that you're going to look to continue? Obviously Broken Saints has got a lot bigger since it was initially quite a small idea and it's grown and grown, but that personal touch has always remained. Is that something that you want to look to continue…?

BB: That was my pledge. That's why we didn't take off our email addresses on the website or within the DVD itself in the credits and crater background. I've received tonnes of mails already from North Americans who have picked up the series and to get in touch directly. And I responded to every single one and not with a stock answer!

JT: That's impressive! *laughter*

BB: Thanks!

JT: That's quite a dedication!

BB: I think that because the work is meant to touch people in a very personal and emotional and sometimes, to some extent, in a spiritual way, that wouldn't it be hypocritical of us not to step down from Olympus and say 'Yes, we are human too! And thank you, spread the word not only of the series, but try to takes some of the ideals that you have experienced and incorporate them into your life and to help others"?

JT: Exactly.

BB: "So be a damn good human being!" How can we preach be a damn good human being if we're sitting back *adopts posh voice* 'sipping champagne and not talking to the commoners'! *laughs*

JT: *laughs* Exactly.

BB: That's just narcissistic.

JT: So the personal touch WILL remain. So, in essence, what do you see is next after Broken Saints? What do you think will come after that? Is there anything that you have in mind - what would you like to do?

BB: Well, yes, first off since you guys are Cubed³. First off - a game version for sure! And you know about that already, and this isn't anything new, but I think that to stress a point that I think maybe not a lot of people have talked about…and I love giving you guys an exclusive…and again Adam rocks…*laughter*

JT: *laughter*

BB: It's really about taking the core story in Saints and of course whittling back a little bit of the self-indulgent, philosophical, poetic dialogue. Yes, it was there for a reason and worked in the medium that we first presented it in. In the game it will still be present to some degree because I think it will be really to have a layer of metaphor and mystery and crypticism within the game version. But at the same time it's going to be more driven by a traditional narrative. That's okay, with that said, NOW is the opportunity to expand upon the world itself and go into so much more detail with the mystery behind the mystery. To explore Raimi's workplace and where he lives. Like the Biocom politics and mechanics and lots of secrets happening with technology there.

To understand and to be able to explore the area where Oran lives in the bunker, where he lives with his countrymen and fellow militia and when he gets to the Nato base and all those areas - you can meet these characters and really expand upon what their meaning was in the story, and discover more secrets about the world itself, about the characters themselves, about the overall plot conspiracy itself, and really get a sense that you are immersed beyond comparison within this fascinating world.

JT: Excellent. So you are looking to create something that feels like Broken Saints is a real world and completely gets people into it as if it was a real experience.

BB: Oooh yes, there will still be stylistic considerations as far as bringing in some of the animated comic quality without making this a fully articulated, 1,000,000 polygon-for-a-character, high-shaded everyone-is-doing…I think making this into a PS3 presentation doesn't cut it for me. If I want to do something that feels like real world, photo-realistic, I'm going to do a live-action mini-series. Whereas I think that doing something really stylised, but with that Saints feeling and essence and allowing you so much freedom to explore, but at the same time create that same gripping sense of tension that the series itself holds, and allowing a new control schematic for the process, that's why I'm so excited about the Wii.

Imagine being able to go through these worlds and control your immersion and your experience in the world in this completely different way, as opposed to two hands locked on to a classic controller, pressing buttons in time with the analogue stick.

JT: With the Wii controller and Wii interface it does allow you to have a more immersive experience, because you can actually control things.

BB: For me it just seems absolutely natural. As soon as it was finally confirmed I said "Wow!". Imagine Oran fighting Shadow Demons in his mind and swinging his knife back and forth or shooting a flare - like in his mind he's having a vision, shooting a flare and destroying these huge monstrous shadows. Or imagine Raimi suddenly immersed suddenly in a world of code, where he has a vision and you're using the controller to fly through and destroy certain aspects of the code at high speeds in order to hack. Imagine Shandala exploring her island, walking through dark island pathways, pushing leaves aside and even something as gentle as fishing with her brother or catching butterflies with her cat could be such a playful experience that would be so much cooler with the Wii than it would be with a traditional controller.

JT: Yeah, so, combining two questions into one: you seem to be hinting, quite strongly, that the game will probably appear on the Nintendo Wii. But just how far along is the game development and would you like to confirm it is on the Wii or not?

BB: I can't confirm much. The reason is I'm under a series of NDAs, which will tell you something! *Pause - to let that point settle in* And with that said I will say that I have always been a Nintendo fan. Adam will be the first to trumpet that, and I think most of our hardcore fans know that of me as well. In fact, it was thought way back in the day that we were some sort of secret Nintendo project.

When the site first launched people were like 'This is way too slick to have been done by three guys". And we kind of hinted our Nintendo leanings in places and people were like "Oh this must be a secret Nintendo game receptacle". I love Nintendo, I love the platforms, even the moments of weakness, the chinks in their armour so to speak, but I think the new platform is incredible. I think that development costs can be cut down. I think that the Virtual Console will provide for an incredible showcase of episodic content and I think that the connection between the Wii and the DS, as far as transferring trailers or additional content…hmm, interactive comic books are really interesting, especially with Metal Gear Solid - they say they're the first to make one. I find that really funny…

I think that all the clues are kind of there for you.

JT: I'll put two-and-two together…

BB: *heavy laughter* You seem like a bright chap!

JT: *laughs* Thank you…How far along is it in development?

BB: It's got to the point now where it's hammering out milestones with the prospective publishers. It's a case of presenting - prototyping is essentially there; character designs, technology tests, design documents; it's all pretty darn good. And it's really just a case of "Okay, so with this proposal and with this budget and this schedule, who do we want to work with?" It's really a case of choosing out of the publishers that are interested, the best possible partner.

JT: Has there been a lot of interest in it then?

BB: There has been a fair bit of interest in it, of course, more so from European and Japanese publishers than from North American that prefer the more straightforward, blow 'em up, killing games. And that's okay, because the calibre of folks who are interested was very heartening and morale raising.

JT: So you've had a lot of good interest from good people.

BB: The interest that has been there has been very strong. It's been from publishers who all your readers would respect.

JT: Excellent. So we're talking big names?

BB: Yes.

JT: Brilliant! Right, so how long before we hear something substantial about the game, do you reckon?

BB: Well *laughs*, it's funny I would have said let's hold off until E3…oh wait, there is no E3!

JT: Exactly, so…

BB: *laughs*

JT: What's the plan?

BB: I would like to be at least able to announce the publisher, the formal publisher arrangement right at the beginning of the New Year. Because, as you know, the wheels of legal and finance when it comes to documentation and agreements…you know those wheels turn very slowly.

JT: They holding you back a bit…

BB: They turn slowly, they hold you back…and especially for dealing with a Japanese publisher. They take their due diligence. They takes MONTHS upon months to review any changes, amendments and concepts, and then they evaluate internally and then you take a flight over and talk about things again, give them a few months to evaluate…I would be patient rather than jump the gun and I'd rather work with the best possible publishing partner.

JT: Take your time and choose the best route.

BB: As soon as I'm allowed to say who the publisher is and what platform it'll be on, I'll let you know right away - it's going to be trumpeted.

JT: And let us know first?

BB: I will!

JT: You mentioned E3 and the cancellation of it. What do you think of the possible downsizing or complete removal of E3 and what sort of things will replace it?

BB: I understand, having worked at EA and being part of E3 and understanding that studios go through such an incredible crunch to get their demos, their prototypes, their games ready to show, and yet the show floor isn't that conducive for an incredible gaming experience, to really evaluate. And it's not really there for consumers; it's their for Press or other game companies to see each other, to compete and make their big announcements.

I can see why it's counter-productive as far as devoting your team's energy, etc, and I think that I remember the days when I used to be so excited over Spaceworld - back in the day. I think if a publisher's big enough, they put on their own show.

JT: Exactly. I mean, someone like EA, we're talking an absolutely HUGE company here, they can easily afford it - they do EA Summer Nights.

BB: EA can, Sony can, Nintendo can, Ubi can - all the big guys can. And then what you have with the smaller publishers is you can maybe have them get together for smaller collective shows, like in the East you have the Tokyo Games Show and that's great. And you have gamer's days, what's that show in Germany again?

JT: Games Convention Leipzig.

BB: Right, right, and then you've got…even if you have things that are more about the developer, like GDC here (Game Developers' Conference) - they showcase stuff there. And heck, even my friends Game & Tyco at Penny Arcade, they're going to be showcasing a whole bunch of software at PAX. Microsoft and Nintendo and a bunch of other developers and publishers are bringing software to showcase there. You can find the place to do it, it's just now it's about creating a broader strategy as opposed to counting on E3 to be the one place journalists will see your game and trumpet them.

JT: It did become a bit of a counter-productive kind of thing.

BB: When I went down to E3, I've been there several times, but the last time I went down to E3 there was the gigantic displays and there was 7.1 surround with extra bass and thousands of people milling about and so much stimuli - I honestly felt like that for two or three days. Like I'd been beaten by a sack of oranges! I felt bruised internally; I could barely walk and I couldn't process information - it was too much!

JT: It is like one giant headache and I think Nintendo, in particular, had a couple of events around Europe where they took the Wii on tour and they had nice leather sofas, snack food, they had people bringing you drinks, and you sat there and enjoyed the console - a limited amount of people allowed in…and that's perfect.

BB: When I went to Comicon it was the exact same thing. They didn't have Wii, but they focused on DS this year?

JT: Yeah.

BB: And they had this great booth, this huge crescent moon, big white scrims, white retro-futuristic chairs, big screens, competitions, people walking around the show floor playing their DSs and doing wireless competitions and there was a really good energy around it. It was perfect.

JT: Yeah. Okay, so you've mentioned EA, so we'll go along with that. You worked with EA for quite a long time and considering that, how much of a hands-on approach are you taking the Broken Saints videogame?

BB: I'm the creative director of the game.

JT: So what does that exactly involve?

BB: It's kind of a mix of the producer roles and designer roles in the sense that I'm the person who will not only shepherd the design, working closely with the publisher to make sure it's fully acceptable with them. But, at the same time, I want to be able to be involved in approving all the assets, because it's not all going to be developed internally by the team in Vancouver. The publishers have all said hey, if this is going to be a handheld and console experience, we're going to want to be involved in the process. So I would want to be involved with those teams on the development level, brain-storming…definitely in writing the scenarios and as much of the dialogue as they will allow me to write, because it has to carry a certain style and certain way to it and I'll fight for design aspects that I think are worth fighting for. That's what a creative director needs to do. I get to step away from the producer role a little bit that I used to have at EA, worrying about budget and schedule, and more so focusing on what's going to make this fun, and what's going to make this a cryptic experience.

And, most importantly, because it's mirroring the original story of the online and DVD, this has the potential to open up the important themes of the story to an even WIDER audience.

JT: Would you be looking for, say in the game, to reveal extra information about the characters and about the world…

BB: Absolutely, absolutely…

JT: So the idea is that people watch the DVD, the comic and play the game to get the entire experience?

BB: Absolutely.

JT: Excellent. So it's going to be the sort of thing that you'd be looking for people to be interested in the series as a whole?

BB: Yes, I think that this is what's great about it. People who are interested in the series will die to play the game - it will be that cool! It'll expand on all the characters they always wanted to know more about and the world. Any questions they might have had, including ones I had and wished I'd had time to explore myself, all of those, you will have a chance to explore them and to really gets answers to them and get a sense of 'Oh, that's what's happening behind the scenes here!' or 'That's why Raimi was behaving this way!' or 'Gawd, no wonder Oran was pissed off here!' That will all make sense, and scenes I had to cut from the original story I'll get to expand in interactive scenes.

JT: But what about people that haven't read the comic?

BB: That's why I'm saying take away, remove or parry down a bit of the philosophical rambling and the poetic musings and make it more focused on the experience…very much like in Indigo Prophecy [ Fahrenheit in Europe ] in the sense that there's a lot of mystery here. It's very dark and mature and the play style itself has adventure aspects as well as action aspects and, maybe even because of the vision sequences, some survival horror aspects. And hopefully that will pull them in deeply enough for them to go 'Wow, this is an incredible story, it's gripping and these characters really interesting. I want to know more about them.' And then they'll want to go watch the series.

JT: Excellent! It's a good plan…So, basically anyone will be more than happy to go into a games shop, see the game on the shelf and think 'Ooh, that looks interesting!', pick it up and understand it.

BB: I think that especially for a platform like the Wii, yeah, we've all voiced what experiences we want on the Wii. Like I may hate the three Star Wars films, but damn straight do I want to swing a light-sabre! Do I want to have a game like Soul Calibur or am I hoping that Red Steel doesn't suck and I can shoot guns and swing my Samurai sword? I think that's great. Will Metroid be cool? For sure. Do I want to drive and fly vehicles? Yes. Do I want to play…all the shooting games will be great for the platform. But with Saints, and in first-person stuff of course, with Saints I think that it's perfect for this platform. Adventure gaming has been dead for a long time, but then only one or two specific titles end up rising to the top.

Now, with this interface, I think all of a sudden adventure gaming has become interesting again.

JT: Yeah, because it's adding something new to the genre that had become quite dead.

BB: Yes, if you want to pick up an item and want to look at it, if you want to solve a puzzle by adjusting something in a room by turning something, opening something, interacting with something, you'll feel like you're doing it.

JT: Well, Adam's asked me in particular to quiz you on the recent game trailer that was revealed that showed elements that appeared to suggest multiple formats. So should we suppose you're looking to do a handheld and a home console version? Or…?

BB: You can happily suppose that.

JT: I can happily suppose that? I shall then…So we're probably talking DS and Wii here, but I won't push you on that.

BB: You can happily suppose whatever you like! *laughter* I can't firmly say either way *more laughter*

JT: I thought it was worth a try…*laughter*

BB: *laughter*

JT: Well, what else…Hmm, I've got a long list of questions here. So, in terms of your predictions the last time we interviewed you, Adam asked you a lot about E3 predictions - Duck Hunt, Pilotwings, Zelda on the Wii, there was loads more in there. Any more kind of secret, inside information that you think is time to share?

BB: What I can say is, because you know I've made some predictions in the past, many of them were close and it turns out the 3D thing, way back in the day, never happened, though it supposedly, from what I hear, was and still is an aspect of the platform that's in development. That said, it was originally to be an add-on for the GameCube but now they are considering it for the new platform. That's fine.

But that said, as far as software is concerned, I can say from my contacts that everyone in the developer community, everyone is either porting something or developing something new because development costs are cheaper, GameCube code has…they can grapple with and understand it, and the dev kits are cheap and that the experience is interesting. It's intriguing. It's going to come down to making sure those physics programmers get a strong handle on the controller itself so the game is fun. But, EA of all folks isn't just doing a straight port of Madden, it's really re-writing the code from the ground-up to really get the throw and flick and fly and duke mechanics down.

If Ubi is making Wii their central console…like seven games for launch, plus more in development…I have contacts here at Ubi and they're like 'Yeah, we love it here!'

JT: And it does say a lot. Ubi and EA are probably two of the biggest publishers in the world and have the biggest game developers in the world…

BB: And all the Japanese publishers are, from what I hear, are also in the same consideration. They are, instead of just doing ports, are actually thinking 'Okay, how exactly can we re-imagine either one of our existing IPs or franchises and develop it for the Wii. But instead of doing a port, they want to make a really special version of it.

Would I love to see Resident Evil on Wii after Resident Evil 4 was one of the most staggeringly cool games in a long time?

JT: It would be fantastic.

BB: It would be absolutely fantastic! Imagine standing in front of your TV with the gun and also a knife and making the motions and the movements…it would be gripping!

JT: It would be fantastic, firing off the shotgun with the Wii controller…

BB: Yes!

JT: …Waving around at fire…

BB: Yes!

JT: It would just be absolutely brilliant.

BB: It would be so, so cool. And to think of stuff like Castlevania, to think of these classic franchises that could do some incredibly cool things. It has me excited…So what I can say is that what I do know, a little bit from my 'spies' here and there, is that that little flight teaser was originally like a Pilotwings test. But it's gradually become part of a package of about three or four games.

I keep hearing rumours that the release of the Wii…they're going to have a bare system, like in the old NES days - a single controller and platform and Virtual Console access, and they're also going to have a two-controller pack-in system…

JT: Ah right, so like a two-tiered launch…with a bit more in one than the other.

BB: Which is what they did way back in the day for NES and SNES.

JT: So it's all gone full circle there.

BB: And I think that it makes sense to have that new controller. I think people want to have that experience right out of the box, especially to create a family hub gaming entertainment system - like they did in the old days. And I think that for them, the two controllers with the Wii Sports bundle that has like three or fours games in it, very simple games, I think that would be the perfect launch strategy for the family that is considering a games platform for Christmas.

JT: You mentioned that companies like EA, Ubisoft, loads of Japanese companies are all taking on the Wii and embracing it and this shows that the big companies are kind of lifting up the torch and saying 'Hey, follow us! This Wii is a really good idea.' And there have been some concerns that the Wii isn't going to be adequately supported as opposed to the 360 or PS3, which might get more support. Do you think that those concerns are misplaced and are you hearing…

BB: Those are completely unfounded. And do you want to know why?

JT: Why?

BB: All companies follow installed base. I think all we have to do is watch the retail members on the first weekend Wii comes out in North America or in Japan. I think this machine is going to blow up…as they say. It's going to be huge. I think sales are going to massive.

JT: I think an awful lot of people are underestimating the amount that the console can sell and if Nintendo can promote it and market it out to the audience right it will…

BB: I think a lot of it is really going to come down to the marketing campaign and traditionally it's not been great when it comes to traditional TV ads and what have you, they make things feel kind of young or they try too hard or what have you. That said, though, the name is interesting, it attracts attention. The ability to be able to walk into mainstream stores like Wal-Mart and what have you, and to play it - and that's going to happen - right, they're going to have play kiosks and stations. And, I still remember the day when I was a little kid and I walked in with my parents into a Seers here, one of the major chains in Canada at the time, and you saw the three systems - the Atari 2600, Magnavox Odyssey and Intellivision all side-by-side with kiosks. And they'd say like 'The family play centre - come here and try with your family and make this the centre of your home!' and this is what we're going to return to.

JT: That never really took off, the idea of being a family entertainment system.

BB: No, no…back in the 80s, though, everyone did sit around with their Atari. I sat around with my dad all the time playing Television Baseball and it was one of those things, sat in front of the TV and people would walk into the room and watch us play for a bit. It doesn't happen so much any more…

JT: Yeah, it died…

BB: Wii, by nature alone, with its play mechanics and physical dynamics, I think that yeah it's going to be the party system.

JT: So it's taking things all the way back to how they were and giving them something really phenomenal as a twist - the Wii controller, the interface, everything about it. So it is a really, really exciting console.

BB: It's more than just a novel idea. I think it has the same opportunity for success as the DS. Clearly blazing the trail, if not more so because as soon as news stories come out and video footage comes out of grandmothers and little kids, and what have you, playing with systems…it's going to fly off the shelves. I honestly think it's going to be this year's hot ticket, 'can't get it anywhere' item because it's sold out all over the place.

JT: I mean, you only have to look at the DS and the DS Lite, I mean here in the UK I was down my local high street the other day and they put up a sign in the window to let you know if they had DS Lites in stock or out of stock. They literally, once they get them in stock, they just sell…and they're gone, just like that. And I think we've seen with the DS and DS Lite all over the world is that they are absolutely phenomenal successes and you're only going to see the same thing with the Wii. Basically Nintendo is sending out its tentacles to have a feel about and just see how the market reacts to the DS and then they're going to wallop it with the Wii.

BB: You know, I completely agree with you. I completely agree with you and think that we're all going to be taken aback by its level of success and like Nintendo thought no one would launch a system that catches on fire, *cough*Microsoft, *laughter* They are going to release a quality product that works and is easy to use, that's fun…and I think that one thing we keep forgetting is that there's another angle, there's another spoke to their strategy that's going to be killer for them and that's Virtual Console.

JT: Yeah, it is massive, and not just in terms of old games, but in terms of Indie games.

BB: Yes.

JT: So that's absolutely fantastic as well. Just a thought - is there any possibility, bringing it back to Broken Saints, do you think that's there's a possibility that it could develop even more in the future and we might see something on the big screen using a comic book styling?

BB: Well, um, here's the thing. I've actually gone down and pitched in Hollywood to a lot of the studios and networks and they all respond really positively. Some of them are like 'Wow, if this is really heavy and really smart and if we screwed this up it could be a huge failure'. So they get afraid of it. But a lot of them responded very positively and we're, I've been, in the process of developing that as well. That said, I don't think a movie, a two-hour movie could do this twelve-hour series justice.

Now, of course I do know that maybe four hours of the twelve-hour series a lot of it is internal monologue and that, like the game, need to be parried back. But, the core narrative itself, the core conspiracy narrative, the four characters realising they're connected to this possibility of an apocalypse, and they search each other out, take these personal quests and they develop and they go through these tragedies and they discover things about themselves and about the plan. And they come together, then they face it, then you finally understand what it really is and the Trojan Horse aspect of it…That can't be done in two hours!

JT: No, but there has been the recent phenomenon in movies, and going on for quite a while, you are getting things like the Lord of the Rings trilogy, you had Kill Bill, which came in the volumes. You've got things like…

BB: It's true, but without a really, really big name director attached to it, cliff-hanger narratives just don't do that well in films. People just don't have the patience to wait, unless it's like a really, really well known story or there's a mamassive cast and director.  That said, I think the mini-series aspect, or the mini-series presentation of Saints would be perfect.
 
JT: So, maybe seeing it appear on TV…
 
BB: I would love that…and the BBC has always been supportive of the format, CBC here in Canada has always been supportive of the format.  I think that a co-production mini-series, like a 6-to-8-hour mini-series would be absolutely perfect…
 
JT: So have you sat down and had talks about it, like with the BBC…?
 
BB: I've had talks with North American studios and networks regarding that and had quite a bit of interest.  And now it's a case of putting it as a package for co-production and going to British and German and related television groups and hopefully get a really great team together, because I think that we're going to have support on this side from Canadian broadcast agencies and from some American ones.  But it will time to really do things right, as it's a global property and a global story that needs to be a multi-territory co-production.
 
JT: A film that I think that stylistically is quite interesting is, have you ever seen Sin City?
 
BB: Yes, of course.
 
JT: Is that something…would you like to see Broken Saints done as live action or as animated?
 
BB: I think Broken Saints as live action definitely.  But I think that, with that said, have you seen any of the footage coming out from 300 yet?
 
JT: No I haven't…
 
BB: Do you know that graphic novel that Frank Miller did?
 
JT: Yeah, I know that…
 
BB: Yeah, but the spark period like during the invasion and that's been done with the next level of HD technology, like similar to Sin City where it's all shot on green screen with the backgrounds all cropped in, but it was what blew everyone away at Comicom this year.  It was incredible what they were able to do in post-production to give it this other worldly look beyond compare.  I think that incorporating elements of that into a Saints mini-series would not only be stylistically incredibly cool, but would also save a lot of money!
 
JT: Yeah, and of course grip onto this new phenomenon that's coming into movie making, all films being that style.  So you'd be following in the lines of films that have both been critically and commercially very successful.
 
BB: You got it…
 
JT: Exactly!  Right, so there's a couple of questions left.
 
BB: I hope Jenny's not mad yet, because I think we're…
 
Jenny: I actually was just about to pipe in.  I actually only have enough time for about one more question…
 
JT: Okay, I will have a look. Okay, I'll combine a couple questions into one.  If you could be any Broken Saints character, which would it be, and also, would you ever consider a spin-off using one of the more popular characters from the Broken Saints world?
 
BB: Oh, interesting!  I can't pick a favourite of characters sadly, because they're all were designed purposely to be different facets of myself.  So, like to pick Oran, well that's kind of an aspect of my drive to discover faith and a sense of devotion and honour and even a kind of explosive physicality, and yet at the same time, to be him, blocking off all the aspects of being Raimi-like, being hyper aware and loving technology and having my vices and always having a fast quip to shoot at somebody.  And then with Shandala it's a case of being able to project one's emotions and be incredibly compassionate and to help others and to heal them and lift them up at the same time if they're down.  I think that all those different aspects of those characters…and for me I couldn't just limit it to one.
 
That said, as far as spin-offs…If there had to be a single character spin-off, I think that it would be a tie between, you know I don't want to give away too much of the story to people, but I have to say between two characters kind of focused on at the end - which would be Raimi and Oran - as a spin-off, either like a novel or game or another series, or what have you, that exploring how Oran has changed with his faith and with his culture, politics and with the military and what have you, after he experiences everything in the series.  Or even doing an origin story for him, and going back to when he was younger and experiencing everything in his war-torn area before he became who he is now, that would be cool.
 
But also for Raimi as well - what happens when you give a person who has been questioning their role in life and their potency, whether they have any power whatsoever, and whether they can make an effect in the world for the greater good…What happens when you give him the ultimate power, which is basically the control over this network that can inspire religious revelation in anyone.
 
JT: Yes, excellent.  Finally, one very, very quick question: there's been a lot of rumour and talk about the Nintendo Wii launch.  What have you heard and when do you think it will come out?
 
BB: I think it will be out before the end of October, at the very latest November 4th or 5th, and I'm expecting it to be US$199 for the core system and $229 or $239 for the bundle.
 
JT: That's the sort of, that's fairly solid info.
 
BB: Sorry?
 
JT: That's fairly solid information, you'd reckon?
 
BB: That's fairly solid information, from what I've been hearing.
 
JT: Excellent!  Right, well, to avoid completely running over, I think we have already, I'd say we wrap it up there, perhaps.
 
Jenny: Thank you very much, James.
 
BB: James, thank you so much!
 
JT: It's been absolutely superb.  I'll get Adam to, or myself - one of us will email your colleagues down a link to the interview when it goes up.  And we might also run a version of this in our audio podcast.
 
BB: Excellent!
 
JT: Maybe, perhaps.  I'll see what the audio quality is like and see what I can do with that.
 
BB: Thank you so much James.  Give Adam a big snog for me!
 
JT: I will do.  Okay, it's been fantastic.
 
BB: Take care.
 
JT: Bye guys.