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Gastrian once again living up to his title : King Of Impartiality Smilie.

Would like to point this out, mostly because it is Tempo and such mistakes from one of our most respected writers is unforgiveable Smilie.

malestrum that is the feeble exsistance

Maelstrom, and existence.

*cough* Smilie.

As for religion. My point and beleifs may seem very single minded and without any sort of foresight, but to be honest, I dont beleive or have faith in any sort of God because life is a lot easier for me if I dont, nor do I try to disprove theories that dont really affect me directly.
Im gonna spend the time you pray to your God, building faith in myself, studying for exams, and being happy.
I dont want or need a God or faith in a divine prescence in my life.

So yea, atheist it is then Smilie

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

How is evolution not proven? How do you think we survived the Black Plague or how Bacteria can get more resistant to anti-biotics?

Again I gotta say atheists, if I kicked you would it hurt?

JUST CAUSE I'M SHORT AND STOUT, IT DOESN'T MAKE ME A LITTLE TEA POT!!!!

I hate how so called Christians are the first to judge, completely intolerant, and never treat people with respect.

Christian, Muslim, Jew, we all believe in the same god...

See no Wiivil
Hear no Wiivil
Speak no Wiivil

Z, I am studying higher biology now.

There is a difference between us evolving from monkeys.
And Bacteria growing tolerant to anti-biotics.

Bacteria are the fastest breeding organisms on the planet (close enough), they breed into their millions, growing exponentially, with such a huge population explosion mutations occur rapidly, eventually one of these mutations will be a fluke and have an immnunity to an anti biotic, this mutation will obviously stick (as all mutations do unless changed again) and when all the other non immune bacteria die the mutated immune ones will continue to breed producing more immune bacteria.

As for the black death, I dont think us surviving it has anything to do with evolution.

*sheds a tear* Mr. Carruthers would be proud! Smilie!

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

*laughs* heh heh shot down by the guy with the gun.(So to speak) *applaudes Redking*

JUST CAUSE I'M SHORT AND STOUT, IT DOESN'T MAKE ME A LITTLE TEA POT!!!!

O/\O

Dont appluade me, applaude natural selection Smilie.

Natural Selection is teh r0x0rz!!!11!!

Oh and appluade me too Smilie

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

Heh heh. I knew you would like the attention.
So mr. atheist, Would it hurt if I shot you in the knee cap?

JUST CAUSE I'M SHORT AND STOUT, IT DOESN'T MAKE ME A LITTLE TEA POT!!!!

Z, the theory of Evolution is just that, a theory.

There is no physical evidence to support Darwin's claim. The only thing that can prove the theory of evolution to be fact is the finding of an transitional animal, otherwise known as a missing link. As yet not a single one of these transitional animals have been found, as such there is no evidence to validate Darwin's theory.

Here's some interesting reading, which while it has a bias towards Islamic belief, the authout supports his views with sound scientific knowledge.

Harun Yaha

Matthew Evans [ Writer :: Moderator :: King of Impartiality :: Lord of the 15min Thread ] As the wind blows the sand to cover the camel's tracks so does time move to cover the Lord's.
Rejoice for the Lord will taketh his quarter and give much back to his followers.

Heh well, I beleive Darwin. I mean It's quite possible. And they think they may have found the missing link too.

JUST CAUSE I'M SHORT AND STOUT, IT DOESN'T MAKE ME A LITTLE TEA POT!!!!

Gastrian wrote: There is no physical evidence to support Darwin's claim. The only thing that can prove the theory of evolution to be fact is the finding of a transitional animal, otherwise known as a missing link. As yet, not a single one of these transtitional animals have been found...

Surely all past species have been 'transitional', and we have fossils depicting and/or implicating the more precise transitions between fish and amphibians, amphibians and reptiles, reptiles and birds.
And transitional animals from mammal to primate I thought had also been identified i.e. Australopithecus (sp?), Homo habilus etc.

If not conclusive beyond doubt, evidence for Evolution is overwhelming, and that's not counting that it seems visually and psychologically pretty obvious.

But, as was said previously, believing in one thing surely doesn't mean sacrificing the other. To a degree, I think it's very healthy for Science and God to go hand in hand, in terms of each balancing and the other. For example, in this debate, Religious doubts about Darwin have ensured that Science cannot rest on its laurels, and Evolution remains a topic of heated debate even today. Ultimately, it's extremely healthy to ask questions of Science and scientific findings, just as it's healthy to ask questions of God/Religion.

[ Edited by Raindog on 2005/1/17 14:51 ]

Doesn't the human body have about three different gene pairs compared to monkeys, or something similar. I think that sort of shows whether or not evolution did occur, the similarities in genetic make up show that variation did occur to cause us to change from every other organism.

Evolution is proven by bacteria and other single celled organisms, but that doesn't mean Darwin got in exactly right...

I should really read everything here - but Gastrian I hope your not insinuating that every evolutionarist is a Darwin follower.

It's like saying every religous person believes in Christ!

I am an evolutionarist but do not share/use any of Darwins theorys in my understanding of evolution - one thing I can tell you as a fact:

We simply didn't just appear on this planet as the life forms that we are!

We evolved.

Barry Lewis [ nin10do :: General Writer :: Feature Writer :: Fountain of Industry Statistics ]
"We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh."

evolution, as someone said, is a theory, and has not been proven. If any of you would like to show me definitve proof that its true, i'd love to see it. But Ill bet you cant, because it doesnt exist.

(I myself would go for evolution over creationism, but it hasnt been proven)

So mr. atheist, Would it hurt if I shot you in the knee cap?

Yes of course it would, what does that have to do with my atheism?

I dont beleive in creationism at all, surely there are more plot holes in religions than in Evolution Smilie.

Personally, I kinda beleive in evolution, but dont even care enough to find out. The only thing that could compell me to join a religion is fear of some hellish after life if I dont.

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

There are certain things in evolution that have been proven. The mistake you are making is thinking I am a Darwinist! (made up word :p)

I am an evolutionarist on many levels, here is one such fact for you, all life on this planet EVOLVED from the key chemicals!

From the simple chemical make up of Carbon/Hydrogen/Nitrogen/Oxygen through to trace elements such as Iron, phospherus, Zinc etc.

We were very lucky that these chemicals etc came from space through meteor at the right time allowing life to evolve - which it did, fact!

See I can talk about evolution on this planet and not once mention a monkey Smilie

Barry Lewis [ nin10do :: General Writer :: Feature Writer :: Fountain of Industry Statistics ]
"We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh."

wheres the proof? Because evolution being fact is news to me.

Anyway, my big theory of the universe:

essentially based on the big bang theory:

if we take it that all matter was once in this very compact theory, and then exploded out, comme the big bang, and we take it that all particles were then headed out at certain trajectory, this means they were always going to follow whatever trajectory they were set on, and always going to react with x particle and y particle, and thus that everything that happens is preordained because theres no way we can avoid it. Hence while we believe we have choice we dont, its just particles reacting in our brains compelling us to do certain things.
You can combine that with there being a god or not, who set up the matter in the tiny space in the first place, personally ive got no idea, but given our knowledge of physics, that much makes sense to me.

Evolution is proven by bacterias resistance to antibiotics. They have evolved to resist the antiobiotics to survive. There is no proof that we did the same, but evolution is present. I think, but GR your theory lost me I'm afraid. Though I suck at Physics so much..

Thanks Sharpy - that's a simple but very effective way of looking at it.

Mutation and Evolution go hand in hand.

Bacteria mutate to become resistant to certain things, like antibiotics - hence why the leading medical professionals and scientists are extremely concerned that the super bug is mutating/evolving and will soon become common out with it's current habitat - i.e. become a main stream virus/bacteria found in our air etc.

Evolution goes hand in hand with environment and creates new species. I DO NOT think we are/were monkeys. We are however in the same family as monkeys but evolved differently when different external factors were placed upon us.

It's the same thing as polar bears having larger leg muscles and coats than the Black bear. Or the panda bear having different teeth than carnivorous bears (like the black bear). They are all bears but different species have evolved differently due to the different external factors.

Or how about the Mountain lion being more agile than the African lion - I could go on and on but I'm sure you understand now GR.

Evolution is fact, some areas are mere theory's, but there is a large amount of Evolution (not Darwin's theory's) that is based on cold, hard scientific fact.

Barry Lewis [ nin10do :: General Writer :: Feature Writer :: Fountain of Industry Statistics ]
"We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh."

So someobody explain the pentadactyl limb then in terms of how that fits in with their evolutionary theory :-@

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh


Evolution is fact, some areas are mere theory's, but there is a large amount of Evolution (not Darwin's theory's) that is based on cold, hard scientific fact.

Yes, it is a fact - theres nothing to believe or not believe - evolution does exist - this is coming from a christian.

But there is no evidence of any kind for us evolving from monkeys - and as a scientist I don't believe that. I don't think the creation is a perfect theory but I think its the best we've got. However most sensible christians these days will be happy to accept that it didn't happen like it said in Genesis. What I believe is that God created people - he might've done it through the big bang and evolution or whatever you like but he created us - now THAT is pretty much scientificly proven that there WAS a creator - lets get that right. There is increasing hard evidence that the universe was created especially for the purpose of us existing.

[ Edited by beamrider2600 on 2005/1/17 20:03 ]

But there is no evidence of any kind for us evolving from monkeys

Helloo! Pentadactyl limb!!! Hello!!!!

I don't think the creation is a perfect theory but I think its the best we've got.

Smilie

I know im a tottal atheist the day when I find the above beleife really really really funny.

I respect your view Beam, I would hate to anger you, but honestly, and im sorry to all God beleiving people out there, I find it hilarious.

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

bleh, just because bacteria have developed resistance to antibiotics, does not mean evolution is fact. It is evidence, but not proof. Get that straight. The existance of evolution is not fact. its a theory, and theres a lot of evidence to support that theory, but there is NOT proof.

Beam wrote: I don't think the creation is a perfect theory but I think its the best we've got.

Only if you live in the American Bible Belt.

And what is this "increasing hard evidence that the universe was created especially for the purpose of us existing"?

Excuse me, can someoen just confirm with me that the pentadactyl limb theory exists?

We're mentalist psychic Scots, which means we can read your mind. If you're lying, your head explodes and we laugh

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